Aileron Stops
Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:07 am
by Direct C51
I am having a bit of trouble with my aileron stops. As it is now, my left aileron limit is the rod on the part below the stick (I can’t remember the plans name for this part) that contacts the control frame and functions as a stop. The right aileron limit is the counterweight contacting the lower wing skin. I rigged the aileron bellcranks per the plans, the ailerons have the appropriate range of motion per the plans, and the sticks are straight up with neutral ailerons. I am confused on how to fix this. I thought the phenolic in the bellcrank was the stop, so I tried adjusting the right bellcrank so that it would hit the phneolic at full travel, and it greatly reduced the range on the left aileron and threw everything off. Has anyone else had this problem? What limits your ailerons?
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 7:52 am
by peter anson
The little peg on the control stick does act as a stop on my Sonex. I glued a short length of neoprene hose on it to act as a cushion.
Peter
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:38 pm
by Direct C51
Peter, those stops limit your ailerons on both sides? I would have to change the right side rigging quite a bit to get the right stop to hit at upper aileron limit.
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:24 pm
by gammaxy
This happened to me too. I wanted the phenolic blocks to be the stops so I ended up making at least one new bellcrank with the holes in the same place but the outline expanded to allow it to hit the phenolic block at the limit. I don’t use any stops at the control stick.
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 7:30 pm
by Corby202
I also used short pieces of neoprene as stops, think I cable tied mine on.
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:17 pm
by peter anson
Peter, those stops limit your ailerons on both sides? I would have to change the right side rigging quite a bit to get the right stop to hit at upper aileron limit.
I think you should be able to get the peg centered by adjusting the lengths of the long aileron push rods - I have the single control stick. If you have dual sticks it should still be possible, but if the frame is not accurately made (that couldn’t happen could it?) the sticks might not be exactly vertical in the neutral position.
Just trying to think of a reasons for one aileron being limited by the wing skin and the other not - The aileron bell-cranks are to be set at an angle of 25 degrees with the ailerons in the neutral position (Drawing SNX-W02, View G-G). If that angle is not correct you could end up with a lot more deflection one way than the other.
Peter
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:32 am
by Darick
I have a temporary problem …brain freeze, undoubtedly caused by the bitter cold here in the northeast. I can’t figure out a logical starting point for aileron throw adjustment, i.e. getting the correct amount of up/down movement and end up with the the stick centered.
I started by setting the ailerons in the neutral position (as measured by the method in the plans) and adjusting the long push tubes to get the stick centered. Up aileron was short by about 4 degrees and down too much. Every time I adjust a push tube it throws something else out. Seems like I’m chasing my tail.
Can someone give me a jump start…starting point? Advice?
Thanks
(…yes I have been flying it this way for 3 hours)
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:47 pm
by Area 51%
To the 99.9% of the people out there that are smarter than me…please ignore this.
I just got done (last week) setting that elusive 25deg angle. I made a fixture that clamped to the bellcrank and contacted the rib at the 25deg mark. I knew all the ribs faced the same direction on both wings, but I had forgotten, and it surprised me a little when I noticed the fixture touched the hole flange on one wing…and the side of the rib of the other. I had to adjust the width of the wedge accordingly.
Here’s my point/question. If geometry is your thing and you came up with a dimension from the control rod attaching hole to the rib face to set the angle, it should throw one or the other off…right? Any chance this might be happening?
Sharing random thoughts while waiting for the missing Aerovee parts to show up here @Area 51%.
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:51 pm
by Rynoth
Interesting, mine definitely stop when the counterweights press the wing skins. This is in a Waiex with dual sticks. Is yours a single stick?
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:13 pm
by Area 51%
Too soon to tell if the control tree stops will do their jobs, but I did find the counter-weight mounts contacting the edge of the rear spar relief hole before the weights touched the skin. On both wings, the weights came up about 1/2in shy of the skin when the arms were stopped by the edge of the hole.
I’m sure a little clearancing will be in order to get full deflection on this project. Something to look into if you have more uppie or downie on one aileron than the other.
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 12:18 am
by daleandee
My aileron stop is on the triangle assembly of the center stick. The aileron weights should not be hitting the wing skin! Here’s a center stick photo (not mine) with the stop clearly visible:
It’s been a few days since I did the set up but I recall that the ailerons/flaps were set using a straight edge up from the rear of the aileron forward over the rivet line at the main spar. There is a measurement from the wing surface up to the straight edge at the overlap area on the spar (I don’t recall that measurement). There is also instructions for the alignment position of the aileron bell cranks in the wings when properly rigged. My DAR would not have passed my airplane if the wing skin was the aileron stop or if my counterweight was contacting the wing spar cut out.
The aileron should have the correct amount of travel each way when the rods are not attached. If you can’t get the required up/down travel without something making contact, then you have a build error. Once you have enough travel then you use the rods to set the length so that as the aileron reaches the end of its travel (its designed up & down travel), the stop on triangle assembly of the stick makes contact. Keep in mind that the positions of the aileron bell cranks will effect this.
Dunno if this helps,
Dale Williams
N319WF @ 6J2
Myunn - “daughter of Cleanex”
120 HP - 3.0 Corvair
Tail Wheel - Center Stick
Signature Finish 2200 Paint Job
166.7 hours / Status - Flying
Member # 109 - Florida Sonex Association
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:38 pm
by Area 51%
With regard to “build error”, FEI, and in my defense, the dimension from the edge of the rear spar to the edge of the counter-balance hole is listed as 5/8in. My super-secret decoder ring translates that to .625in. What I got with the factory rear spar was .662in. Not a lot to be sure, but enough to make contact when no interference should be present.
Just not sure weather to take the material from the spar or the counter-balance arms.
Re: Aileron Stops
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2022 3:08 am
by NWade
Direct C51 wrote:I am having a bit of trouble with my aileron stops. As it is now, my left aileron limit is the rod on the part below the stick (I can’t remember the plans name for this part) that contacts the control frame and functions as a stop. The right aileron limit is the counterweight contacting the lower wing skin. I rigged the aileron bellcranks per the plans, the ailerons have the appropriate range of motion per the plans, and the sticks are straight up with neutral ailerons. I am confused on how to fix this. I thought the phenolic in the bellcrank was the stop, so I tried adjusting the right bellcrank so that it would hit the phneolic at full travel, and it greatly reduced the range on the left aileron and threw everything off. Has anyone else had this problem? What limits your ailerons?
Did you ever resolve this problem? I believe I’m running into the exact same issue you had.
When I move the stick throughout its range, the stop on the stick makes contact with the control triangle when I put the stick to the left. But when I put the stick to the right I find the right wing aileron counterweight is making contact with the lower skin when the control stop is a little less than 1/8” off the control triangle.
But here’s the odd thing: when I use an angle finder to measure the full-deflection positions of each aileron, both are achieving about 20 degrees up and 11 degrees down. The same total travel on each aileron despite the stick travel being different in each direction! Starting with the stick vertical and the ailerons and flaps all rigged neutral per the plans, I can deflect the stick 28 degrees to the left but only 24 degrees to the right (whereupon the counterweight contacts the lower skin). Both bellcranks are set to the 25-degree angle relative to their nearest wing rib, so how am I getting the same control deflections for a different amount of stick deflection?
Any ideas or experience solving this issue is much appreciated!
—Noel
P.S. I thought about playing with the aileron bellcrank angle in the right wing to get a different ratio of stick movement to aileron deflection, but the spanwise pushrod ends were already screwed down as far as possible (I.e. to shorten the rod length) just to get the plans-specified 25 degree angle! I can’t shorten it any more without taking an angle-grinder to the threaded rod…